Other > Suggestions

Bring back old colourizing

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Kilgore:
Old NC:
- too much additional time wasted to add new faction nicknames to it, enemies, other players, additional time wasted for making everyone download and use current list
- "I have never seen that dude but somehow magically, I know from which team he is! C'mon, I've just downloaded our latest NC!" <- it's stupid imo
- no way to make one list which always make all gang members coloured, without need to update it
- easy to make large alliances, just update one list and make everyone download it

New NC:
- you probably make one list and have all gang members coloured, without worrying about updating it
- you know who is who if you encountered the player before and remember his name, what he was doing etc.
- more difficult to make large alliances, as you need one base to add all chars or remember all nicknames of allied members (and hope that they remember you also)

"Namecolorizing" thing is just against fallout reality imo.

Izual:
To me, the fight against Namecolorizing is above all a fight for realism and equality in this game.

With Namecolorizing, bigger factions are given an advantage towards the smaller ones. Each member of a faction adds his own encountered players to the list. This means if everyone adds two characters to Namecolorizing per day, a faction with 50 members will have +100 names in his Namecolorizing per day and a faction with 10 players, +20 names. This is how some big factions looked like the CIA last wipe, and some others like nothing. It is as unfair and unfalloutish as having a daily income because you controlled a city once and put all the caps in your bank.

We are playing a multiplayer Fallout game, guys, not World Domination Corporation. This game should not be about getting as many caps as possible and as many colored guys as possible. In this topic I heard both "It prevents us from sparing lives in TC because now we have to shoot everybody" and "The lack of Namecolorizing is not at all a problem for bigger factions". Well, you know what. I think it's better like that. You "need" to shoot everyone during Town Control operations? You're trying to control a town using guns and shiny armors, lads, so don't start worrying about your poor collateral victims. The bigger your alliance will be, the more you will try to seize control of something - the more you will kill innocent people. This is not a problem. This doesn't need to be fixed. The argument about "innocent victims" - which is not a new one - is an invalid argument. There is always a possibility to chose not to kill; if you chose to kill, then it is because your goal - most of the times, TC - is more important than killing few innocent wanderers. And obviously, it is. You're a gang trying to seize control of a town thanks to pure strength, so don't whine about needed violence to achieve this goal. If Town Control is such a slaughter, then I suggest you stop doing it - reading the posts above mine, it looks like you won't need Namecolorizing anymore.

Now that was about the irrelevance of some of the arguments I heard; I will now try to explain what bothers me the most with Namecolorizing system. One of these things is, as stated in the first paragraph, that not all factions are equal with it. It's another thing that gives bigger gangs advantages towards smaller gangs, that have no Intelligence Department. The second thing, and I don't think it is an arguable point, is that Namecolorizing is shareable. You start in the game, here's a list of who's who, who is good and evil. You add a guy in your Namecolorizing, hey, the whole team will now shoot him or not shoot him.
I believe in players interactions. I want to have tagged only the people I know. This is why the current system is fine, by the way - maybe more colors would be good, I don't see a problem with adding more: you can only tag people that you met. And in this game, people you met are almost all the time people that you talked with or fought with. Lordus, you said that it's annoying to have to repeat to your team-mates "Don't shoot X, don't shoot Y, don't shoot Z". Well, this is what happens in real fights, you know. I don't want to have someone tagged green that I never met. Maybe you do. I don't want to have friends I never heard of, nor enemies I never heard of. Namecolorizing is a team-to-team vision, current system is based on individual relationships. And I think it fits Fallout better, as well as enhancing game experience. What is the most interesting - to download a huge home-made list of who to shoot and who not to shoot, or to meet people, to talk with them, to interact with them, and only then to tag them?

Yes, I'm only talking about tagging red and green. "That's not true! Namecolorizing.txt provides a lot of different colors". Wrong. Even if you use a lot of colors (one for each team, for example), orange, blue, grey, white, purple, all these colors can be put in two categories: "To shoot" and "Not to shoot". Red and green. This is a nonsense to talk about mid-evil people or mid-good people in this game; if you want to have cautious attitude with someone, leave him untagged or make a third color for "To be cautious with" characters.

Another of the used arguments is something like this: "Namecolorizing allows us to recognize teams". Yes, sure it does, I can't deny it. There's only one problem: this list of faction members is available to you even if you never heard of the faction. Also, it is a subjective list, made by your friends. I am in favor of "teams recognition", like with some kind of uniform for each faction or with Jack_FR's logos-in-nicks idea. It is different from Namecolorizing for two reasons: first, it is fair because everyone has the same information. Second, it is an objective information. No red, no green: Player X is member of team Y. I don't see any problem with this kind of information if there is no way to personalize it - one color/flag/uniform chosen randomly for each faction, I think this is fair. Everyone sees faction Y with blue and yellow stripes, everyone sees faction Z with black and white flag, that was given to them by the server. But as far as I know, developers don't want this kind of instant-recognition. By then, I prefer current system - you make your own, un-shareable records. A personal and subjective list of the people you met - the very same character diary that can be found in any good role-playing game.

runboy93:

--- Quote from: Izual on November 17, 2010, 09:31:57 AM ---We are playing a multiplayer Fallout game, guys, not World Domination Corporation. This game should not be about getting as many caps as possible and as many colored guys as possible.

--- End quote ---
I know that you are played Fallout games much Izual.. and you should know that Fallout is nothing more than killing persons!
You maybe do it for good, but still.. you kill people and become great vault dweller.
And i remember i said sometime something about caps and power.
If you got caps you got everything

Kinkin:
You know Izual we talk about it yesterday on Mumble, from our point of view, different colors, even if it's a "dark" color doesnt mean we will shoot.

For example, before wipe, we used orange color for people "under investigation", this means we saw these people do bad things but they aren't considerated as outlaw, we just keep an eye on their actions to see how they really play, then we change their colors when we are sure.

Light pink color was used for people who were outlaw but don't want to be anymore outlaw, they are on reconciliation status to us... So we keep our atention on them, and if after a short time they proved their good actions, we exclude them from the list.

These examplesworks with Lawyers cases, but i'm sure that many other teams used it in that way.

There are :
- bad guys to shoot on sight
- Bad  guys to observe and judge
- Bad guys "trusted" (for example some usual TC ooponents but with who we can talk in peace when it's not TC)
- Random Bad Guy (shooted only if it's a threat)
- Neutral Guys
- Good Guys

So color on names doesn't means "automatic shoot". it depends on context.

"Indexing" wasteland is part of our roleplay, and this part doesn't really exist right now, because it's only red-white-green. We used to like doing massive taging and provide full list of one team or list of criminals ike our old LCR(Lawyer Criminal Record).

avv:

--- Quote from: Izual on November 17, 2010, 09:31:57 AM ---A personal and subjective list of the people you met - the very same character diary that can be found in any good role-playing game.
--- End quote ---

Good role-playing games also have combat that doesn't rely so much on first strike, or you can atleast see when random player is going to attack you before you got a bullet in your skull.

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