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Poll

Do you like this suggestion?

Yes.
- 6 (66.7%)
Yes, with some changes.
- 1 (11.1%)
No.
- 2 (22.2%)
I don't have opinion.
- 0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 9


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Author Topic: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.  (Read 1556 times)

RJ

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Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« on: October 16, 2010, 11:26:52 pm »

As we all know some NPCs patrols appear on encounters in nice formations. VC patrol ist mostly in inverted wedge formation, Hub patrol in wedge formation, NCR Army in line formation and so on... It makes sense that biggest factions/cities in wasteland trained well enough their soldiers so they are disciplined and keep formation all the time. Question is why some other groups like robbers, highwaymans and so on also use military tactics? Did they all were trained or are ex-military?

So what I would like to suggest is that first we divide all NPCs into two groups: untrained combatants (farmers, highwaymans, robbers etc) and trained combatants (BoS, Hub, NCR, VC etc patrols or caravans). Second thing is that groups can't appear closer than at least 30 hex from each other.

Successful Outdoorsman roll vs random encounter with:
- Untrained combatants - you can catch them off guard, scattered away from each other and your group (players) will appear in one of few (random or perhaps customizable) formations. [to simulate that player group noticed and prepared themselves against NPC group which wasn't aware of player group presence]
- Trained combatants - you can catch them in staggered column formation and your group (players) will appear in one of few (random or perhaps customizable) formations. [to simulate that players group noticed encountered marching NPC patrol and prepared themselves]

Unsuccessful Outdoorsman roll (failure) vs random encounter with:
- Untrained combatants - you can be catched off guard by and circled by NPCs or NPCs away in staggered column. Your group (players) might appear very close to each other or in staggered column. [to simulate that NPCs ambushed player group or didn't notice player group and just marched toward them]
- Trained combatants - you can be catched off guard and circled by NPCs or NPCs appearing in proper combat formation . Your group (players) might appear very close to each other or in staggered column. [to simulate that NPC group noticed player group and prepared themselves]

For exact checking in which formation players will appear it would be good to have one more roll (it could be even roll on Speech skill [with caps for skill so raising over fe: 150 won't do much] justified by that the higher leader Speech the better organized group is) before entering encounter. The lowest roll would mean worst scenario for players entering encounter and best NPCs/players inside encounter. There could be some bonuses/penalties introduced for each of scenario (fe: penalty for NPCs AP if they are caught off guard). Scenario where players group encounter other players could be solved similiar way (just perhaps without being circled possibility). This could be good start for reworking how players appear on other players encounters (no unrealistic 3 hex away insertion points).
Also players that are in encounter when new players are entering should be warned via console message from which direction new travellers will appear.

Perhaps if players appear in formation would depend of some new perk of group leader or if they are trained NPC faction members. I belive that this would make random encounters system more interesting and realistic for PvE and PvP purposes.

Some of suggested and already existing in game formations (bad quality but hopefuly you will get idea):
Staggered column (Couldn't find better picture, a bit similiar to RoTA formation)
Line (NCR Army)
Wedge (Hub Patrol)
Vee/Inverted Wedge (VC Patrol)

Anyway it's time for you to give some feedback about suggestion and ask questions.

P.S.: I know that it might sound a bit complicated and "military" but it's good simulation of how random encounters should look.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2010, 09:59:05 am by RJ »
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Michaelh139

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Re: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2010, 02:45:40 am »

You DICK!  I was JUST thinking about this idea but nooooo.   ...  joking your not a dick you saved me from carpal tunnel syndrome :D.


Yes, yes, yes, I hate how players are ALWAYS RIGHT NEXT to each other and a single rocket simply rapes the group while npcs get these nice little lines and formations, ugh.  Plus yeah, it would make pvp more interesting as well, and give Outdoorsman an even bigger role, and posibly speech as well.
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kraskish

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Re: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2010, 03:20:07 am »

I read it but couldnt make any sense of it. Its about outdoorsman roll positioning in the battle? Hell yeah, Outdoors is always tagged  8)

Seriously, sometimes those encounters positioning makes no sense, youre stuck between and boom... but what if there are X, You and Z, X and Z are fighting each other you wait, everyone is in an isosceles triangle and then another person comes and goes where? In the middle?
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RJ

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Re: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2010, 07:18:25 am »

@kraskish

Yes, it's about outdoorsman roll positioning on battle of players that enter encounter as well as for NPCs that are "in encounter".
Introducing scenario where you meet other group while it's "travelling" - unprepared for combat (unlike now when both groups just stand infront of each other) with possibility that it will be YOUR group that is being "ambushed".
It's also about that all NPCs should be divided to two groups and each of those groups would have diffrent way that they appear in encounters
Not sure how to put it in other words. I will make some images to show it better.
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Re: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2010, 07:50:31 am »

i have small outdoors so i say NO for this idea
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avv

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Re: Reworking random encounters and NPCs/players formations.
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2010, 10:26:48 am »

Seems good but it has problems with currently existing features.

It's basically all the same in what sort of formation they are because they will break it immediately. It would actually be worse if the npcs were scattered because then you could accidentally run in them while escaping. Besides, the npcs somehow always know where everyone is and chase him down forever. So this suggestion wouldn't have much sense before something is done about that.

Another thing is that what's the point of encounters killing players in first place? So I got blasted to bits by unity without even wanting to fight them, what's that for anyone? Nothing. Nobody gains anything from that. So until encounter fights start to have more consequences, they shouldn't be any more deadly. This was an answer to the failed od roll.

i have small outdoors so i say NO for this idea

Hell yeah, Outdoors is always tagged  8)

Could you guys be any more selfish?
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